NEWS: Pro-Gun Gays are Making Headlines

greyboi's picture

Did anyone think of the possibility that guns may actually be used for an anti-violence cause? "What", you say, "But isn't that contradictory?" Apparently not. A long time ago a smart person thought that it was a good idea for women in areas where there was a high instance of rape to carry concealed hand guns to protect themselves. Well, a new idea has been emerging in the last three years.

Meet, Pink Pistols I thought this site was interesting. It's run by a group of gay conservatives and libetarians. Being a libertarian, myself, I found out about it through the Independent Gay Forum, a site for gay conservatives, moderates, and libertarians.

Pink Pistol's mission is to reduce the number of gay bashings by showing gay people (and a few other heavily targeted groups for hate crimes) how to defend themselves with firearms. As Jonathan Rauch (one of my favorite gay libertarians) put it:

"Thirty-one states allow all qualified citizens to carry concealed weapons. In those states, homosexuals should embark on organized efforts to become comfortable with guns, learn to use them safely and carry them. They should set up Pink Pistols task forces, sponsor shooting courses and help homosexuals get licensed to carry. And they should do it in a way that gets as much publicity as possible. "[Salon Magazine, March 13, 2000]

Imagine how quickly the incidence of gay bashing would plummet, when every street thug knew that all of us were armed, trained and weren't gonna take it anymore!

It's a very conservative approach to a very liberal cause, and the group has taken equal amounts of heat and light from both sides. Radical gay liberals who otherwise would have been anti-gun have actually embraced policy. On the flip, very traditional and conservative groups (like the NRA) who tend to have a notoriously homophobic stance are going arm-and-arm with this trend, because it's pro-gun.

It seems gay conservative groups like the Log Cabin Republicans have actually touched base on an issue that both sides have agreed on. Being gay and Republican or Libertarian may actually make some sense afterall.

You don't have to be a gay Republican or Libertarian to support this effort, but you do have to have a conservative stance of gun laws to do so. In the end, when a few creative minds get together and draw both sides into an agreement, we all end up winning.
---------------------------------

Tell me what you think. I know that as soon I am of age, I'll surely be signing up for the Los Angeles Chapter of Pink Pistols. :)

greyboi's picture



RoaG's picture

Is it just me... or is the

Is it just me...

or is there something simultaneously disturbing and sad about this?

Scruffy the Vampire Slayer's picture

guns are scary anyway you like at it

ok let me start by saying i live in ireland. we don't have the same gun laws i'm sure you know. however senseless violence on our streets is getting out of control here. We are weapon ourselves with out firearms. factor them in and it gets worse. i wouldn't condone guns as protection for anyone. i can see someone having a field day is some gay person pulled a gun.
so i say no to all this.
"The hardest thing in this world is to live in it" Buffy- The Gift

Jazzer's picture

How about that?

Never heard of the group, but I think it's a great idea. While I agree it's sad in one respect that people are having to resort to defending themselves in the first place, I think it's much sadder that there are those GLBT people that are injured and/or that die needlessly simply because they don't know how to --or won't (!!!)--defend themselves.

Don't get me wrong: if people are going to use guns, they should be well-educated on how to safely use them and be certified to carry a concealed weapon or else there'll be more trouble than we know what to do with.

Let's not mix up defending one's self when attacked with flagrantly waving around a firearm. Defending ourselves is a right that we ALL have as humans roaming about the Earth. Indeed, animals have ways to defend themselves when they're attacked, why shouldn't we?

jules's picture

yeah...

Animals don't use bullets.

~Jules
________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

jules's picture

Um?

Bowling for Columbine. Did anyone understand that documentary?

Personally, I'd rather get the shit kicked out of me than point a gun at someone.

~Jules
________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

linds's picture

ditto.

well said, as always.

~Linds

-----
Special Advisor on Chocolate Issues for The Movement To Free Oompa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

Jazzer's picture

Question, then....

Honestly, never saw the documentary, so I can't comment one way or another.

I'm curious since when is it wrong for someone to defend him/herself when he or she is accosted for no good reason?

To me, it sounds as if (and PLEASE don't look at this as a slam at all, because I adore you all) you're scared of the idea of guns in general, or at the very least, made uncomfortable by it. This discomfort for many (not all) can be caused by lack of the right kind of exposure to guns. Please read on....

Like JB, I was exposed to them at a very young age by my stepdad, who is a certified pistol instructor. I was shown how to safely handle and fire guns, but even perhaps more importantly, we had MANY long talks about the appropriate use of guns (using them on someone at school because you're pissed of at them = bad idea. Using a gun on someone trying to kill or otherwise harm you with lethal force = a pretty reasonable idea).

Therein lies the key. You see, if someone verbally threatens you and you unload on them, that's not really cool, and indeed, it's outright illegal. What a lot of people don't realize is that when someone uses a gun for self-defense, there are actually quite a few criteria that have to be met in order for it to be just in the eyes of the law.

While I can't speak for everybody, I know that this aforementioned lawfulness is at the heart of what I'm saying. What about all those bad people misusing guns? Lock 'em up! (Both the people and their guns.) What about the good people who don't misuse them? Well, we need lots more of them around.

I think it's similar to GLBT people portrayed in the media sometimes: it seems that all we ever see are the outrageous, outspoken ones. While we know better, people think that's how we ALL are.

Along the same lines, I think that the media is extremely one-sided when it comes to the portrayal of guns: after all, who would have gone to see a documentary about the safe use of firearms? What news program would say, "And today, Fred Jones went through the entire day without misusing his pistol,"?

Hopefully I've done a little better job of articulating exactly where I stand on the issue, and you DON'T think of me as a gun-wielding fanatic (although some may).

Michael

"When we stop acting like victims, they'll stop treating us like victims."

jules's picture

this ain't an armchair answer

It isn't about a fear of guns, Michael.

~

When I was nineteen I was assaulted while running through a park. Not three months later, this time armed with a knife, I was walking across campus and was again assaulted. I stabbed the assailant.

It is fine to talk about lawfulness and our rights to self-defense and the appropriate use of firearms. Fine. Talk about it. I think it's important that people are educated on the safe use of firearms.

I am. Wholly. It isn't about a fear of guns.

I just won't use them.

And you're damn right that the idea of carrying a gun to protect myself makes me uncomfortable. Feeling threatened to the point of arming myself makes me uncomfortable. That we've all just accepted arming ourselves as a reactive solution makes me uncomfortable.

It makes me uncomfortable. And it very well fucking should.

I have had blood on my hands, Michael. The adrenaline takes over and you just pull that trigger or push that knife through skin and you're so afraid that you barely remember doing it. And I watched his eyes widden, heard him gasp, held the weight of him as he sagged to the ground. To see skin open where before it was closed, to have been the one who opened it. To stand over the person you wounded trying to keep their blood inside them, crying because it won't stay inside them. To have the person who minutes before refused you mercy, to have that person beg for mercy.

Until you are there, Michael, you will never understand that in that moment I was a victim because I defended myself in the way I did. Not victim in the way you mean victim, but a victim nevertheless - deeply and profoundly a victim.

What I did was fucking wrong.

The law didn't say so, it gave me a pat on the back and a good for you. But what I did was still wrong.

Not arming myself has nothing to do with acting like a victim and everything to do with not putting myself in the position where my fear will pull a trigger.

Because I don't want blood on my hands.

I reiterate and alter my previous statement: I would rather have the shit kicked out of me than point a gun, any weapon, at someone - even if they were pointing one at me.

That's my principle. I own it. I'm not asking you to do the same.

~Jules

As for the documentary, until you see it don't assume its content or its form.

________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

greyboi's picture

Look at it this way...

This started because a guy was about to be stabbed by a homophobic thug. He pulled out his gun, fired it into the air and scared the crap out of him so much that he just ran away. This program is not intended to promote violence. If anything, it sends the message that violence towards gays won't be taken anymore.

When I was taking about "gay bashing", I wasn't talking about just getting beat up. That's technically "bashing", but not the tone that I wanted to present. What we're talking about here is preventing hate crimes by helping people learn to defend themselves properly.

Imagine what Matthew Shepard could have done if he knew martial arts (gay self-defense courses) and carried a concealed gun under his belt. Sure, he'd be taking a chance that they'd use the gun against him, but it's SURELY better than sitting there and hoping that they let you live.

jules's picture

thoughts

If a woman passes me on the sidewalk, calls me a dyke - that is a hate crime. It is violent.

If that woman spits in my face - that is a hate crime. It is violent.

If that woman pulls a knife on me - that is a hate crime. It is violent.

If she pulls out a gun, fires it into the air and points it at me - that is a hate crime. It is violent.

If I pull out a gun, fire it into the air and point it at her - equally, that is a hate crime. It is violent.

~

A deductive proposition.

Hate is fear.
They that hate, oppress.

Oppression is fear.
To oppress is violent.

Violence is fear.
Guns make violence.
Guns make fear.

Fear lets us hold guns.
Make violence.
Make oppression.
Make hate.
Make more fear.

Scaring away homophobically motivated violence by making more fear, opressing the oppressor, make them afraid to oppress us?

It does fuck all for getting rid of homophobia.

~

Hate that is scared away does not go away. Hate that is reasoned away, educated away, communicated away on the other hand...

~

Violence shouldn't be taken by anybody anymore.

Nice message, though. We're gay and we don't want your violence. So we're going to shoot you. Maybe.

~

Matthew Shepard.

You're right. The outcome of that night in Larabie, Wyoming, may have been different.

They still would have hated him.
Someone still would have hated him.

There's a lot of hate out there.
And that same night in Kenton, Kentucky, it could have been someone else.

~

Guns connotate violence.
That's why it makes people afraid knowing we hold one.
Holding one is violent.
Owning one is violent.

I'm just saying that I will not own violence.
Own fear.
Own oppression.
Own hate.
Or own a gun.

Like I said, these are my principles. I own them. And I'm not asking you to do the same.

~Jules
________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

JB's picture

A layover

Well, A layover from my "straight" days, My dad was a hunter and trapper, I grew up in a suburbian area through the week and every weekend was dragged to teh cottage which is in the rural recess's of my Province. I learned how to use a gun at a young age. Rifles mostly, also learned how to defend myself with a hunting knife incase I was attackd by an animal while in the woods. I still have these skills. Mind you I don't have a gun now, or a hunting knife, but I still have those self defence skills.

Also the issue of being gay bashed. Beig gay, and me saying this will ruffle some featehrs again. if you act vulnerable, then you will be vulnerable. keep your chin up and look confident, shouldn't have a problem. if you do, use yer feet.

JB
Vice President and Drug Tsar of The Movement To Free Ommpa loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalsitic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

el's picture

imagine

what if a struggle happens and your gun ends up in the hands of ur assailant?? (which did not have a gun wif him in the first place)

sometimes, things will not happen as planned.......the assailant pulls the trigger and you actually supplied him wif the murder weapon...how ironic

jeff's picture

If...

If gays hate people who hate gays, and shoot them, is it a hate crime?

Jeff

jules's picture

see, "thoughts"

posted below.

~Jules
________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates

jeff's picture

Actually...

I was just being facetious. I don't believe in hate crimes. Just crimes.

Jeff

jules's picture

yeah

I know you were and I wholly agree.

I'm just giving my notice as to why.

~Jules
________________________
Historian of The Movement To Free Ommpa Loompa Land From The Tyrannical Rule Of The Evil Capitalistic Despot Willy Wonka And Associates